Satan, Lucifer, The Devil

[Xbalanque]

I found your experience at age 3 very interesting - and interesting that some told you it was of the devil.

Not sure if this will mean anything to you, but IMHO, one can learn from evil just as much as love and should not be therefore afraid to learn from it. But at the same time, I am not suggesting that one should seek it out. If I feel with certainty that something is evil, I stay far away. For one stuck in duality, evil is not something to play with.

But if I am not sure one way or the other, I am not afraid to learn more from it since I feel that one can learn from anything, even so-called "evil". Remember that even evil is an aspect of "God":

For ex: "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things." —Isaiah 45:7

This same teaching can be found in all religions.

So many these days are obsessed with identifying evil - some say The Beatles, (esp. John Lennon) was evil, or "Harry Potter" is evil, others have claimed that  Benjamin Franklin was evil.

While it's possible these things are true, from my perspective, unless one can "feel" the evil associated with that person or thing (which is possible), or the evidence is overwhelming, I simply don't worry about it.

So for the orb experience you had, if you did not feel evil associated with it, from my perspective, it almost certainly was not evil.

(btw: I actually have a photo of an orb floating next to me - a fairly large one, and very typical of orbs being photographed lately)

I'm really vibing with you here Xbalanque~

I genuinely appreciate you and your willingness to bring your Light into taking another look at some ideas about the devil, demons and dark subjects in genre ~

I was not introduced to the defintion of  'evil' until age 11, until then, well ... I did not know how to describe, define or express this, so, this is from my early intro into this forum and newbie or no ... you and All newbies are most welcomed here ... refreshing the well ~

I have really InJoyed reading your response here and will say that I do indeed blend with what you are sharing ... these 'things' thoughts, ideas have been shared here in this forum under a topic of sound in meditation. Last years archives ... Adrian, Darrell, Tessa were active on this one ...

Immersed In The Presence of Divine Love expressing from within,

Julia

http://www.ourultimatereality.com/forums/what-is-the-meaning-of-white-orbs-with-a-golden-surround-t595.0.html;msg3570#msg3570

[juliainkc]

Yes it was and I was told not to speak of this experience ever or others would think I was crazy...

It was a very empowering experience for me even when told otherwise and one that was tucked within...

I am grateful to have had this experience ...

I really do appreciate your sharing here and I must say I agree with you that one can indeed learn equally from what is experienced as 'evil' as well as what one considers to be not evil. Love is in all things and everywhere present and I sense you and I may share a close view of what Love means here.

I haven't experienced both fear and Love in the same moment, I have experienced fear that was overcome by Love's calm Presence ...

I find your sharing here as walking along on common ground, truth.

This verse from Isaiah you quote here was one I while in the throes of digging and uncovering the languages and meanings in the Bible , took this one to the Pastors of the church I was once a member of and the response was ...

There are some things not meant for us to know.

Well ... I have to say I agree with your thoughts flowing through here my friend.

I don't worry either (been there and done that), and yes, I have shared in other posts here about my days back in the church days and I agree, that too many people are too quick to define evil really...

I leave myself open to the daily experience and begin it with inviting Divine Guidance ...

and this has kept me as it seems you as well as others here from going on all sorts of rabbit chases.

I appreciate you Xbalanque,

Love in Divine Spirit,

Julia

I found your experience at age 3 very interesting - and interesting that some told you it was of the devil.

Not sure if this will mean anything to you, but IMHO, one can learn from evil just as much as love and should not be therefore afraid to learn from it. But at the same time, I am not suggesting that one should seek it out. If I feel with certainty that something is evil, I stay far away. For one stuck in duality, evil is not something to play with.

But if I am not sure one way or the other, I am not afraid to learn more from it since I feel that one can learn from anything, even so-called "evil". Remember that even evil is an aspect of "God":

For ex: "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things." —Isaiah 45:7

This same teaching can be found in all religions.

So many these days are obsessed with identifying evil - some say The Beatles, (esp. John Lennon) was evil, or "Harry Potter" is evil, others have claimed that  Benjamin Franklin was evil.

While it's possible these things are true, from my perspective, unless one can "feel" the evil associated with that person or thing (which is possible), or the evidence is overwhelming, I simply don't worry about it.

So for the orb experience you had, if you did not feel evil associated with it, from my perspective, it almost certainly was not evil.

(btw: I actually have a photo of an orb floating next to me - a fairly large one, and very typical of orbs being photographed lately)

I'm really vibing with you here Xbalanque~

I genuinely appreciate you and your willingness to bring your Light into taking another look at some ideas about the devil, demons and dark subjects in genre ~

I was not introduced to the defintion of  'evil' until age 11, until then, well ... I did not know how to describe, define or express this, so, this is from my early intro into this forum and newbie or no ... you and All newbies are most welcomed here ... refreshing the well ~

I have really InJoyed reading your response here and will say that I do indeed blend with what you are sharing ... these 'things' thoughts, ideas have been shared here in this forum under a topic of sound in meditation. Last years archives ... Adrian, Darrell, Tessa were active on this one ...

Immersed In The Presence of Divine Love expressing from within,

Julia

http://www.ourultimatereality.com/forums/what-is-the-meaning-of-white-orbs-with-a-golden-surround-t595.0.html;msg3570#msg3570

[Xbalanque]

Love is in all things and everywhere present and I sense you and I may share a close view of what Love means here.

Actually I cannot really say what love is. For me it goes hand in hand with hate and makes no sense except from a dualistic POV. Duality IMHO is the key to understanding the mystery of existence. This is an important teachings found in all religious traditions (even though sometimes it may be masked behind parable).

Seng T'san, the third Zen patriarch of China [d.606 AD], said the following:

"The Great Way is not difficult for those who have no preferences. When love and hate are both absent everything becomes clear and undisguised. Make the smallest distinction however, and heaven and earth are set infinitely apart."

"If you wish to see the truth then hold no opinions for or against anything. To set up what you like against what you dislike is the disease of the mind."

—Hsin Hsin Ming

My feeling based on my own awakening is that he's correct. And yet since I am now also trapped in duality, I won't deny that love is preferable to hate, but I also must acknowledge hate. I would argue that we all harbor a shadow side and if we deny this basic fact, it will force itself to be reckoned with. This actually happened to me in a very physical manner (almost supernaturally so) shortly after my epiphany. I was denying that part of me, trying to be "good" and thinking of myself as a 'good" person.

In other words, love cannot exist without hate. And if one wants evil deeds to stop, then one must also stop good deeds.

From Ashtavakra Gita:

"Enough of wealth, sensuality, and good deeds. In the forest of samsara the mind has never found satisfaction in these." 10.7

"Abandon desire, the enemy, along with gain, itself so full of loss, and the good deeds which are the cause of the other two -- practice indifference to everything." 10.1

It is the nature of duality (that which creates and destroys) — balance between the opposites is always maintained. That if one manifests love, they are indirectly manifesting hate as well.

[juliainkc]

 

Xbalanque, anyone who has been here for awhile while will attest to my fascination with the language 'arts'...

Here's a quote that I like;

""The entire journey in God is a journey in symbols, in which one is constantly aware of the higher realities within things.

Symbols are vehicles of transmission of Divine realities, which transform us by carrying us to the higher states of being from which they originate."

~ Laleh Bakhtiar, Sufi expressions of the Mystic Quest


I actually find your way of defining the undefining refreshing.

Again, communication here seems to be expressed in words 'trying' to define the formlessness of its Source.

Your sharing here blends nicely with what I express as the way I am seeing 'Unconditional Love' which is a term undefined yet we use words to express to one another in our own unique way. If I keep myself open or in the center than I find there is gold in each ones sharing that I can add to my experience. I am blessed and benefitted by ones sharing.

And this causes myself to stumble over the words speaking as a fellow being in this dualistic realm. I also consider duality being of a split mind. Ongoing and finding that stepping out of the mind set and just being while allowing another to just be is assisting me greatly in maintaining a state of what has been defined as Silence. Not rockin and rolling so much on the words spoken, more so focused on being intuned to the energy 'behind' the words.

This idea continues to grow and deepen as I continue along with you and All others in this Life experience.

I do appreciate you Xbalanque and your unique voice here truly.

InJoy this day!

Love to you and All in Spirit,

Julia

[Xbalanque]

Thank you Julia - I really appreciate this thought concerning unconditional love. Could it be that unconditional love is the original source - as opposed to love with conditions as found in the physical world?

I am not sure, but it's food for thought. During my stay in "heaven" (don't know if that's what it really was of course) - but in this place I was immersed in overwhelming, unconditional love, and I can honestly say that I did not want to leave.

Your sharing here blends nicely with what I express as the way I am seeing 'Unconditional Love' which is a term undefined yet we use words to express to one another in our own unique way.
Julia

[juliainkc]

Here's to food for thought! Not being sure can be a wonderful place to be.

Leaves the door open ...

I have heard it said that any way we can define 'God', God isn't and Unconditional Love perhaps could be another thought to include here... as in to define IT is to limit it ... doesn't mean we cannot play with IT though!

I liked your expression on experiencing 'heaven', it is wonderful and lends to my leaning that 'heaven' is not so much a place but an experienced Presence ...

That one is also open to the totality of possibilities ... a round table conversation.

Thank you Xbalanque for communing here with me and All.

Love in Divine Spirit,

Julia

Thank you Julia - I really appreciate this thought concerning unconditional love. Could it be that unconditional love is the original source - as opposed to love with conditions as found in the physical world?

I am not sure, but it's food for thought. During my stay in "heaven" (don't know if that's what it really was of course) - but in this place I was immersed in overwhelming, unconditional love, and I can honestly say that I did not want to leave.

[ahwander]

Dear TheBaron,

the first few chapters in my book are about the Devil, Demons, and Hell.  That can be found at Illuminati and can be read for free.   

I could not access that.  Is it still available?

[Kadensnga]

Here's to food for thought! Not being sure can be a wonderful place to be.

Leaves the door open ...

I have heard it said that any way we can define 'God', God isn't and Unconditional Love perhaps could be another thought to include here... as in to define IT is to limit it ... doesn't mean we cannot play with IT though!

I liked your expression on experiencing 'heaven', it is wonderful and lends to my leaning that 'heaven' is not so much a place but an experienced Presence ...

That one is also open to the totality of possibilities ... a round table conversation.

Thank you Xbalanque for communing here with me and All.

Love in Divine Spirit,

Julia

I am laughing out loud at your ability to communicate these concepts. What wonderful skill you have with words, and spiritual language. It's amazing. That being said...what else is there to say?

[wavepsychic]

I didn't know this was here.

Well none of those exist as religion tells us. They are merely parts of our selves. The negative part of our minds.

Lucifer is the Demon of Pride

Satan or Amon is the Demon of Wrath

   1. often Devil In many religions, the major personified spirit of evil, ruler of Hell, and foe of God. Used with the.
   2. A subordinate evil spirit; a demon.
   3. A wicked or malevolent person.
   4. A person: a handsome devil; the poor devil.
   5. An energetic, mischievous, daring, or clever person.
   6. Printing. A printer's devil.
   7. A device or machine, especially one having teeth or spikes and used for tearing.
   8. An outstanding example, especially of something difficult or bad: has a devil of a temper.
   9. A severe reprimand or expression of anger: gave me the devil for cutting class.
  10. Informal. Used as an intensive: Who the devil do you think you are?